• Sign In
  • Create Account
  • Sign Out
  • My Account
  • NEWS
  • PRODUCTS
  • CONTRACTORS
  • ENGINEERS
  • RADIANT & HYDRONICS
  • INSIGHTS
  • MEDIA
  • RESOURCES
  • EMAGAZINE
  • SIGN UP!
cart
facebook instagram twitter linkedin youtube
  • CONTRACTORS
  • BATH & KITCHEN PRO
  • BUSINESS MANAGEMENT
  • HIGH EFFICIENCY HOMES
  • TECHNOLOGY
  • WATER TREATMENT
  • PMC COLUMNS
  • PMC COLUMNS
  • Dave Yates: Contractor’s Corner
  • John Siegenthaler: Hydronics Workshop
  • Kenny Chapman: The Blue Collar Coach
  • Matt Michel: Service Plumbing Pros
  • Scott Secor: Heating Perceptions
  • ENGINEERS
  • CONTINUING EDUCATION
  • DECARBONIZATION | ELECTRIFICATION
  • FIRE PROTECTION
  • GEOTHERMAL | SOLAR THERMAL
  • PIPING | PLUMBING | PVF
  • PME COLUMNS
  • PME COLUMNS
  • Christoph Lohr: Strategic Plumbing Insights
  • David Dexter: Plumbing Talking Points
  • James Dipping: Engineer Viewpoints
  • John Seigenthaler: Renewable Heating Design
  • Lowell Manalo: Plumbing Essentials
  • Misty Guard: Guard on Compliance
  • RADIANT & HYDRONICS
  • RADIANT COMFORT REPORT
  • THE GLITCH & THE FIX
  • INSIGHTS
  • CODES
  • GREEN PLUMBING & MECHANICAL
  • PROJECT PROFILES
  • COLUMNS
  • SPONSOR INSIGHTS
  • COLUMNS
  • Codes Corner
  • Natalie Forster: Editorial Opinion
  • Guest Editorial
  • MEDIA
  • PODCASTS
  • VIDEOS
  • WEBINARS
  • RESOURCES
  • INDUSTRY CALENDAR
  • DIRECTORIES
  • EBOOKS
  • PM BOOKSTORE
  • CE CENTER
  • MARKET RESEARCH
  • CLASSIFIEDS
  • EMAGAZINE
  • EMAGAZINE
  • ARCHIVE ISSUES
  • CONTACT
  • ADVERTISE
  • PME EMAGAZINE ARCHIVES
search
cart
facebook instagram twitter linkedin youtube
  • Sign In
  • Create Account
  • Sign Out
  • My Account
  • NEWS
  • PRODUCTS
  • CONTRACTORS
    • BATH & KITCHEN PRO
    • BUSINESS MANAGEMENT
    • HIGH EFFICIENCY HOMES
    • TECHNOLOGY
    • WATER TREATMENT
    • PMC COLUMNS
      • Dave Yates: Contractor’s Corner
      • John Siegenthaler: Hydronics Workshop
      • Kenny Chapman: The Blue Collar Coach
      • Matt Michel: Service Plumbing Pros
      • Scott Secor: Heating Perceptions
  • ENGINEERS
    • CONTINUING EDUCATION
    • DECARBONIZATION | ELECTRIFICATION
    • FIRE PROTECTION
    • GEOTHERMAL | SOLAR THERMAL
    • PIPING | PLUMBING | PVF
    • PME COLUMNS
      • Christoph Lohr: Strategic Plumbing Insights
      • David Dexter: Plumbing Talking Points
      • James Dipping: Engineer Viewpoints
      • John Seigenthaler: Renewable Heating Design
      • Lowell Manalo: Plumbing Essentials
      • Misty Guard: Guard on Compliance
  • RADIANT & HYDRONICS
    • RADIANT COMFORT REPORT
    • THE GLITCH & THE FIX
  • INSIGHTS
    • CODES
    • GREEN PLUMBING & MECHANICAL
    • PROJECT PROFILES
    • COLUMNS
      • Codes Corner
      • Natalie Forster: Editorial Opinion
      • Guest Editorial
    • SPONSOR INSIGHTS
  • MEDIA
    • PODCASTS
    • VIDEOS
    • WEBINARS
  • RESOURCES
    • INDUSTRY CALENDAR
    • DIRECTORIES
    • EBOOKS
    • PM BOOKSTORE
    • CE CENTER
    • MARKET RESEARCH
    • CLASSIFIEDS
  • EMAGAZINE
    • EMAGAZINE
    • ARCHIVE ISSUES
    • CONTACT
    • ADVERTISE
    • PME EMAGAZINE ARCHIVES
  • SIGN UP!
Radiant & HydronicsThe Glitch & The Fix

The Glitch & The Fix: Identify the flow problems

The Glitch and The Fix Figures 1 and 2
September 27, 2024
✕
Image in modal.

The Glitch:

The two photos below were from the same project. Flow is upward through the vertical pipe in Figure 1. Without any more details being described, can you spot at least two problems in each photo?

Figure 1

Figure 1

Figure 2

Figure 2

The problems and the fixes

Let’s start with Figure 1. Flow through the vertical pipe is upward. The inlet of that circulator is only about 5 inches above the tee. That’s an invitation for turbulence. As a general rule, you should provide at least 10 diameters of straight pipe upstream of any circulator. The tube leading into the circulator looks to be 3/4” so there should be at least 7.5” of pipe upstream of the flange.

Staying with Figure 1, there’s a temperature sensor held to the surface of the horizontal pipe using a single zip tie. That sensor should be secured to the pipe with at least two high temperature-rated zip ties, and then fully insulated. As mounted, this sensor will report a temperature value somewhere between the surface temperature of the pipe and the surrounding air temperature. The controller it connects to can only act on the information received from the sensor. Even with that controller perfectly installed, it’s not likely to produce the expected results.

Poorly mounted sensor = improper controller operation = noticeable problem = callback.

If you look really close at that sensor you’ll see that the “saddle” groove on the housing — which is meant to fit the curvature of the pipe — is not in contact with the pipe. It’s facing the camera. Figure 3 shows a zoomed in view.

Figure 3

Figure 3

Perhaps you think I’m getting “picky” with this detail, but why not do it the way the installation instructions show? Doing so would not cost more or increase installation time.

Finally, look at the pipe behind that temperature sensor in Figure 1. Do you see a circulator mounted with its motor shaft vertically oriented? If not, look again, it’s there. Best practice with any wet rotor circulator is to mount it with its shaft horizontal. This reduces the longitudinal loading on the bushings supporting the motor shaft.  It also helps rid the rotor can of entrapped air.

Close call

In Figure 2, you can see a larger diameter pipe that serves as a header for the circulator that’s visible, (and three other circulators you can’t see). Just to the left of the tee supplying the circulator is another temperature sensor strapped to the header with a zip tie, and very poorly insulated. Another case of poor “sensorship,” as shown in Figure 4.

Figure 4

Figure 4

The header supplying the circulator turns vertical near the left side of the photo. There you can see two tees that are “sorta close.” There looks to be at least 10 inches of pipe between the centers of those tees, which are meant to provide hydraulic separation between the boiler circulator and the header pipe. Putting the tees as close as possible is better than “sorta close.” It reduces undesirable “ghost flow” from one circuit to another.

Could it still work as installed in this system? Probably, but if you fully understand the concept underlying closely spaced tees, you’ll appreciate that putting them as close together as possible is better than sorta close.

Are you an ace troubleshooter?

PM’s Hydronics Editor John Siegenthaler, P.E., will pose a question to you, our readers, to review a system’s schematic layout and discover its faults, flaws and defects. Good luck! Read More The Glitch & The Fix⮞

KEYWORDS: circulators flow rate hydronics plumbers and pipefitters troubleshooting

Share This Story

Looking for a reprint of this article?
From high-res PDFs to custom plaques, order your copy today!

Recommended Content

JOIN TODAY
to unlock your recommendations.

Already have an account? Sign In

  • Worker using the Milwaukee Tool SWITCH PACK drain cleaner

    Pipeline profits: Drain cleaning, pipe inspection create opportunities

    Drain cleaning and inspection services offer lucrative...
    Plumbing News
    By: Nicole Krawcke
  • Uponor employee, Arturo Moreno

    The reinvestment in American manufacturing and training

    Plumbing & Mechanical Chief Editor Nicole Krawcke and...
    Plumbing News
    By: Nicole Krawcke and Natalie Forster
  • March 2024 Women in Plumbing hero image of woman engineer overlayed by circle of hexagon shapes with numbers from 1 to 10

    Celebrating 10 Influential Women in the Plumbing Industry

    Celebrating Women's History Month and Women in...
    Plumbing News
    By: Nicole Krawcke
Subscribe For Free!
  • eNewsletters
  • Online Registration
  • Subscription Customer Service
  • eMagazine
  • Manage My Preferences

Bell & Gossett Illustrates Path to Net-zero at AHR Expo

Bell & Gossett Illustrates Path to Net-zero at AHR Expo

NIBCO Press Solutions

NIBCO Press Solutions

AI can boost efficiency and profitability for plumbing, HVAC contractors

AI can boost efficiency and profitability for plumbing, HVAC contractors

IPEX celebrates grand opening of new Florida distribution center

IPEX celebrates grand opening of new Florida distribution center

More Videos

Sponsored Content

Sponsored Content is a special paid section where industry companies provide high quality, objective, non-commercial content around topics of interest to the Plumbing & Mechanical audience. All Sponsored Content is supplied by the advertising company and any opinions expressed in this article are those of the author and not necessarily reflect the views of Plumbing & Mechanical or its parent company, BNP Media. Interested in participating in our Sponsored Content section? Contact your local rep!

close
  • J.J. Keller CMV vehicles on road
    Sponsored byJ. J. Keller & Associates, Inc.

    The dash cam game-changer for small business safety

Popular Stories

Figure 1 is a sketch of the flow problems of the current plumbing system.

Hydronic heating glitch solved: Why adding a circulator won't fix primary loop flow issue

The interior of a government building.

President Trump signs executive order promoting skilled trades and apprenticeships

Six tankless water heaters that feed the nutraceutical manufacturer’s operations.

How to deliver large volumes of hot water quickly and intermittently

PM BEMIS June 25 Free Webinar: Optimizing Plumbing Solutions for Single-Family, Multi-Family & Public Spaces

Events

November 13, 2024

Future Proofing MEP: Navigating the 2026 High Efficiency Water Heating Standards

Join our deep dive into DOE’s new standards so you can future-proof your MEP practice.

EARN: 0.1 ASPE CEU; 1 AIA LU/HSW; 0.1 IACET CEU*; 1 PDH

View All Submit An Event

Poll

Will business be up or down in 2025?

Do you anticipate business in 2025 to be up or down in comparison to 2024?
View Results Poll Archive

Products

The Water Came To A Stop

The Water Came To A Stop

See More Products

Download the FREE Water Conservation, Quality & Safety eBook: Plumbing Trends Increasing Safe Water Availability

Related Articles

  • glitch-fix-feature

    The Glitch + The Fix: Plethora of problems

    See More
  • glitch-fix-feature

    The Glitch & The Fix: Circulator problems

    See More
  • Figure 1 is a sketch of the flow problems of the current plumbing system.

    Hydronic heating glitch solved: Why adding a circulator won't fix primary loop flow issue

    See More

Related Products

See More Products
  • M:\General Shared\__AEC Store Katie Z\AEC Store\Images\Plumbing\new sites\classic_hydronics.gif

    Classic Hydronics - How To Get The Most From Those Older Hot-Water Heating Systems

  • what hydronics taught holohan.jpg

    What Hydronics Taught Holohan: A Memoir of Life in the Heating Industry

  • 51CHeeKvw4L._SX322_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg

    Hydronic Radiant Heating: A Practical Guide for the Nonengineer Installer

See More Products
×

Keep your content unclogged with our newsletters!

Stay in the know on the latest plumbing & piping industry trends.

JOIN TODAY!
  • RESOURCES
    • Advertise
    • Contact Us
    • Directories
    • Store
    • Want More
    • Supply House Times
  • SIGN UP TODAY
    • Create Account
    • eMagazine
    • eNewsletter
    • Customer Service
    • Manage Preferences
  • SERVICES
    • Marketing Services
    • Reprints
    • Market Research
    • List Rental
    • Survey/Respondent Access
  • STAY CONNECTED
    • LinkedIn
    • Facebook
    • Instagram
    • YouTube
    • X (Twitter)
  • PRIVACY
    • PRIVACY POLICY
    • TERMS & CONDITIONS
    • DO NOT SELL MY PERSONAL INFORMATION
    • PRIVACY REQUEST
    • ACCESSIBILITY

Copyright ©2025. All Rights Reserved BNP Media.

Design, CMS, Hosting & Web Development :: ePublishing

search
cart
facebook instagram twitter linkedin youtube
  • Sign In
  • Create Account
  • Sign Out
  • My Account
  • NEWS
  • PRODUCTS
  • CONTRACTORS
    • BATH & KITCHEN PRO
    • BUSINESS MANAGEMENT
    • HIGH EFFICIENCY HOMES
    • TECHNOLOGY
    • WATER TREATMENT
    • PMC COLUMNS
      • Dave Yates: Contractor’s Corner
      • John Siegenthaler: Hydronics Workshop
      • Kenny Chapman: The Blue Collar Coach
      • Matt Michel: Service Plumbing Pros
      • Scott Secor: Heating Perceptions
  • ENGINEERS
    • CONTINUING EDUCATION
    • DECARBONIZATION | ELECTRIFICATION
    • FIRE PROTECTION
    • GEOTHERMAL | SOLAR THERMAL
    • PIPING | PLUMBING | PVF
    • PME COLUMNS
      • Christoph Lohr: Strategic Plumbing Insights
      • David Dexter: Plumbing Talking Points
      • James Dipping: Engineer Viewpoints
      • John Seigenthaler: Renewable Heating Design
      • Lowell Manalo: Plumbing Essentials
      • Misty Guard: Guard on Compliance
  • RADIANT & HYDRONICS
    • RADIANT COMFORT REPORT
    • THE GLITCH & THE FIX
  • INSIGHTS
    • CODES
    • GREEN PLUMBING & MECHANICAL
    • PROJECT PROFILES
    • COLUMNS
      • Codes Corner
      • Natalie Forster: Editorial Opinion
      • Guest Editorial
    • SPONSOR INSIGHTS
  • MEDIA
    • PODCASTS
    • VIDEOS
    • WEBINARS
  • RESOURCES
    • INDUSTRY CALENDAR
    • DIRECTORIES
    • EBOOKS
    • PM BOOKSTORE
    • CE CENTER
    • MARKET RESEARCH
    • CLASSIFIEDS
  • EMAGAZINE
    • EMAGAZINE
    • ARCHIVE ISSUES
    • CONTACT
    • ADVERTISE
    • PME EMAGAZINE ARCHIVES
  • SIGN UP!